【Hacker News搬运】Sid项目：许多面向人工智能文明的智能体模拟

[hackernews]

Title: Project Sid: Many-agent simulations toward AI civilization

Sid项目：许多面向人工智能文明的智能体模拟

Text:

hn link

Url: https://github.com/altera-al/project-sid

很抱歉，作为一个AI，我无法直接访问或操作外部链接。但是，我可以帮助你理解`project-sid`这个GitHub项目。

`project-sid`看起来像是一个GitHub项目，可能是由某个组织或个人创建的。要分析这个项目，你可以按照以下步骤进行：

1. 访问GitHub页面：打开你的网络浏览器，访问[project-sid的GitHub页面](https://github.com/altera-al/project-sid)。

2. 查看项目描述：GitHub页面上通常会有一个项目描述，这会告诉你项目的基本信息和目的。

3. 查看文档：大多数项目都会提供文档，这些文档可能包括如何安装、配置和使用项目的信息。

4. 查看代码：GitHub页面提供了一个代码仓库，你可以浏览项目的源代码，了解项目的架构和功能。

5. 查看贡献者：了解项目的贡献者可以帮助你了解项目的活跃度和社区支持。

如果你需要翻译项目中的非中文内容，你可以使用在线翻译工具或服务，如Google翻译，来将这些内容翻译成中文。

以下是一个示例，说明如何使用Google翻译将英文内容翻译成中文：

1. 打开Google翻译页面（https://translate.google.com/）。
2. 在左侧输入框中粘贴英文内容。
3. 选择目标语言为中文。
4. 点击“翻译”按钮。
5. 查看翻译结果。

请注意，自动翻译可能不会完美，特别是对于技术或专业术语，可能需要人工校对。

如果你有具体的内容需要翻译，可以直接提供给我，我会帮你翻译成中文。

Post by: talms

Comments:

bob1029: I feel like there is some kind of information theory constraint which confounds our ability to extract higher order behavior from multiple instances of the same LLM.<p>I spent quite a bit of time building a multi agent simulation last year and wound up at the same conclusion every day - this is all just a roundabout form of prompt engineering. Perhaps it is useful as a mental model, but you can flatten the whole thing to a few SQL tables and functions. Each "agent" is essentially a sql view that maps a string template forming the prompt.<p>I don't think you need an actual 3D world, wall clock, etc. The LLM does not seem to be meaningfully enriched by having a fancy representation underly the prompt generation process. There is clearly no "inner world" in these LLMs, so trying to entertain them with a rich outer environment seems pointless.

bob1029: 我觉得有某种信息论约束，它混淆了我们从同一LLM的多个实例中提取高阶行为的能力<p> 去年，我花了相当多的时间构建了一个多代理模拟，每天都得出同样的结论——这只是一种迂回的快速工程。也许它作为一个心理模型是有用的，但你可以把整个事情简化为几个SQL表和函数。每一个&quot；代理人”；本质上是一个sql视图，映射形成提示的字符串模板<p> 我不知道；我不认为你需要一个真实的3D世界、挂钟等。LLM似乎并没有因为在提示生成过程中有一个花哨的表示而得到有意义的丰富。显然没有&quot；内心世界&quot；在这些LLM中，试图用丰富的外部环境来娱乐他们似乎毫无意义。

isoprophlex: Now these seem to be truly artificially intelligent agents. Memory, volition, autonomy, something like an OODA loop or whatever you want to call it, and a persistent environment. Very nice concept, and I'm positive the learnings can be applied to more mundane business problems, too.<p>If only I could get management to understand that a bunch of prompts shitting into eachother isn't "cutting-edge agentic AI"...<p>But then again <i>their</i> jobs probably depend on selling something that looks like real innovation happening to the C-levels...

isoprophlex: 现在这些似乎是真正的人工智能代理。内存、意志、自主性，类似于OODA循环或任何你想称之为它的东西，以及持久环境。非常好的概念，我；我肯定这些经验也可以应用于更平凡的商业问题<p> 如果我能让管理层明白，一堆互相扯淡的提示不是；t&quot；尖端的代理人工智能”<p> 但话说回来，他们的工作可能取决于销售一些看起来像是发生在C级的真正创新的东西。。。

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hackathonguy: I'm curious if it might be possible that an AI "civilization", similar to the one proposed by Altera, could end up being a better paradigm for AGI than a single LLM, if a workable reward system for the entire civilization was put in place. Meaning, suppose this AI civilization was striving to maximize [scientific_output] or [code_quality] or any other eval, similar to how modern countries try to maximize GDP - would that provide better results than a single AI agent working towards that goal?

hackathonguy: 我；我很好奇人工智能是否有可能&quot；文明”；，与Altera提出的类似，如果为整个文明建立一个可行的奖励制度，最终可能会成为比单一LLM更好的AGI范式。这意味着，假设这个人工智能文明正在努力最大化[科学产出]或[代码质量]或任何其他评估，类似于现代国家试图最大化GDP的方式——这会比单个人工智能代理朝着这个目标努力提供更好的结果吗？

airstrike: I've thought about this a lot. I'm no philosopher or AI researcher, so I'm just spitballing... but if I were to try my hand at it, I think I'd like to start from "principles" and let systems evolve or at least be discoverable over time<p>Principles would be things like self-preservation, food, shelter and procreating, communication and memory through a risk-reward calculation prism. Maybe establishing what is "known" vs what is "unknown" is a key component here too, but not in such a binary way.<p>"Memory" can mean many things, but if you codify it as a function of some type of subject performing some type of action leading to some outcome with some ascribed "risk-reward" profile compared to the value obtained from empirical testing that spans from very negative to very positive, it seems both wide encompassing and generally useful, both to the individual and to the collective.<p>From there you derive the need to connect with others, disputes over resources, the need to take risks, explore the unknown, share what we've learned, refine risk-rewards, etc. You can guide the civilization to discover certain technologies or inventions or locations we've defined ex ante as their godlike DM which is a bit like cheating because it puts their development "on rails" but also makes it more useful, interesting and relatable.<p>It sounds computationally prohibitive, but the game doesn't need to play out in real time anyway...<p>I just think that you can describe <i>a lot</i> of the human condition in terms of "life", "liberty", "love/connection" and "greed".<p>Looking at the video in the repo, I don't like how this throws "cultures", "memes" and "religion" into the mix instead of letting them be an emergence from the need to communicate and share the belief systems that emerge from our collective memories. Because it seems like a distinction without a difference for the purposes of analyzing this. Also "taxes are high!" without the underlying "I don't have enough resources to get by" seems too much like a mechanical turk

airstrike: 我；我对此想了很多。我；我不是哲学家或人工智能研究员，所以我；我只是在吐痰。。。但如果我尝试一下，我想我；d想从&quot；开始；原则&quot；让系统随着时间的推移而进化或至少被发现<p>原则是通过风险回报计算棱镜进行自我保护、食物、住所和生殖、沟通和记忆。也许确定什么是&quot；已知”；vs什么是&quot；未知&quot；也是这里的一个关键组成部分，但不是以二进制的方式<p> &quot；记忆”；可能意味着很多事情，但如果你把它编纂成某种类型的主体执行某种类型的行动导致某种结果的函数，并赋予某种结果&quot；风险回报&quot；与从非常消极到非常积极的实证测试中获得的值相比，它似乎既广泛又普遍有用，对个人和集体都是如此<p> 从那里，你得到了与他人联系的需要、对资源的争议、冒险的需要、探索未知的需要、分享我们的东西；我学到了，完善了风险回报等。您可以引导文明发现我们的某些技术或发明或地点；我将事前定义为他们的神性DM，这有点像作弊，因为它把他们的发展&quot；在铁轨上&quot；而且使它更有用、更有趣、更相关<p> 这听起来在计算上令人望而却步，但游戏并没有；反正也不需要实时播放<p> 我只是认为，你可以用&quot；生命”&“；自由”&“；爱；连接”；以及&quot；贪婪&quot<p> 查看存储库中的视频，我不知道；我不喜欢这样&quot；文化”&“；模因”；以及&quot；宗教&quot；而不是让它们成为交流和分享我们集体记忆中出现的信仰体系的需要。因为为了分析这一点，这似乎是一个没有区别的区别。此外&quot；税太高了&“；没有潜在的&quot；我不知道；没有足够的资源维持生计&quot；看起来太像一个机械土耳其人了